Horse Trailer World - Trailer Talk
Doing your own living quarter

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the wrist

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Subject : Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 7:58 AM
Post #131382

Hi, I am new to this site. I am tring to do my own living quarters.  I looked on the site redrench and was puzzled by the insulation installed.  They had aluminum taped all around each section.  Is this something to do and why is this done? Also what about wiring what do you use for ac and what do you use for dc. 
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retento

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 8:05 AM
Post #131383 - In reply to #131382

This site may answer some of your questions.... http://todd.redwrench.com/index.htm

 


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GRNMCHNEDAZE

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 8:47 AM
Post #131391 - In reply to #131382

There are a couple of ways you could do AC and DC.

In my trailer, I have 2 completely seperate systems. One is the DC system that I run from 2 deep cycle batteries. This powers the lights, furnace blower, and the water pump. It's easiest to run the wires to a fuse block and then hook them up from the battery.

The AC system is just a small breaker box that has 1 30 amp breaker. I wired 5 outlets in different locations for various appliances (fridge, microwave, griddle, coffee maker, etc.) The only connection between the 2 systems is a battery charger that only operates if the trailer is plugged in to shore power.

The other option is to get a converter. It's essentially the same idea (some come with the breaker panel and fuse blocks to wire the seperate systems), but will convert 110 to 12v while plugged in to shore power and charge the battery(ies).


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the wrist

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 9:09 AM
Post #131392 - In reply to #131382

Thanks, What gauge do you suggest for the DC. 
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GRNMCHNEDAZE

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 9:25 AM
Post #131395 - In reply to #131382

I wouldn't go any smaller than 16 gauge. I used 14 and 16 gauge stranded THHN.  
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wyndancer

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 10:57 AM
Post #131400 - In reply to #131382

I wouldn't go anything less than 14 gauge...prefer 12. Voltage drop on 12v is amazing.
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GRNMCHNEDAZE

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 11:10 AM
Post #131403 - In reply to #131400

Originally written by wyndancer on 2011-03-09 11:57 AM

I wouldn't go anything less than 14 gauge...prefer 12. Voltage drop on 12v is amazing.

True, but for lights and short distances, its not really noticeable. The thicker gauge is good for the higher draw equipment like the pump and furnace.

12 gauge and larger is so hard to work with. When you're connecting to lights that have 18 gauge leads, it makes it a chore.


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wyndancer

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 1:10 PM
Post #131415 - In reply to #131382

I prefer not to have to keep various spools of wire around, short of the various colors used to keep track of things. Don't under estimate the draw of lights...those 1156 blubs, which most RV lights use, draw 2.1 amps/bulb. Wire a couple of 2 bulb fixtures together and you reach the capacity of 16 wire. Think of halogen loading lights...55watts/ea..switch a couple on at once, 16g wire won't have you smiling.
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GRNMCHNEDAZE

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 2:53 PM
Post #131417 - In reply to #131382

Well that could be why I haven't had any issues. I have 1 bulb fixtures individually wired to different wall switches.
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tr0y

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 3:45 PM
Post #131421 - In reply to #131382

Doing your own LQ is not hard, if you have any experience in the trades it is even easier. Some may differ with me but an LQ trailer is really just a cabinet making job, if you have remodeled the kitchen or bath you can do this easy.

As for your electrical questions I am going to go out on a limb here and say I bet I have one of the more extensive electrical systems in a LQ on this board. Here is what I have done. 500 Watts of Solar, a charge controller, 1KW of battery storage, and a large inverter / charger. We have a mix of 12VDC and 120VAC in the LQ.

12VDC powering the AV systems, water pump, and lighting.

120VAC Powering the fridge,AC, Microwave and interior and exterior plugs.

We had a built in generator but it was bulky and was poor on fuel, it has since replaced with a Honda 2000 inverter generator, we did lose the auto start based on voltage, but it is really only necessary when running the AC for long periods of time without the ability to plug into shore power.

As for wire size, we chose to wire the trailer like a home, wired to NEC specs with Romex and separate wires where it made sense. Wire size is determined by Amperage and the length of the run of the wire.

The Romex is 12g for circuits up to 20A both at 12v and 120v.

We did wire the 12V tap off the battery bank with 6g to the DC distribution block as the run was approximately two feet and if everything DC in the trailer was at full rated amperage, 100 Amp total, 6g at two feet is fine.
Here is a DC wire size chart to help 12v is at the bottom. http://www.windsun.com/Hardware/Wire_Table.htm

We also ran a power center with four 20A breakers for the 120V allowing the fridge and micro to share one, the AC has its own, plugs have a circuit and I have an open circuit for expansion or if I need to split the fridge and micro.

Dual solar arrays are wired from panels to combiner box with 10g exposure rated wire, combiner has two 15A breakers to isolate the panels, from the combiner to the 35A charge controller is wired with 6g again to have less than 3% voltage drop and then from the controller to battery bank with #0 welding cable and custom copper cable ends.

From the inverter charger side we have a 50A capable 8g RV power cord to shore-power, the inverter is 1500 watts AC with surge to 3000 Watts AC and will run 24/7 at over 75% of rated output. If need be it will charge battery bank at 70A through 2/0 welding wire battery cables with custom copper battery lugs.

As for the battery bank it is 6 330AH AGM sealed batteries, no fuss, no muss, just a lot of power.

If anyone has an interest I will post photos if asked.

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GRNMCHNEDAZE

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 5:00 PM
Post #131429 - In reply to #131382

Holy power system batman...I would love to integrate a solar charge system one day...
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the wrist

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 5:16 PM
Post #131431 - In reply to #131382

very impressive. I am just a beginner when it comes to electrical.  I'll have to look over your notes over. I think everyone would love to see some pictures.  I am just starting my project. I am still on insulation concerns. I have a Kiefer and put 1" pink foam board between the supports.  Do you need to foil all around all the pieces of inserted foam to prevent moisture coming through?

 Then comes to what ceiling and wall board to use?  Didn't like what was at Lowe's or Home Depot. What have most people used.


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slowrider

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 7:53 PM
Post #131442 - In reply to #131382

We used wall board from YBC, or another local independent hardware store. Looks like wallpaper, you can choose from several different designs, and you can buy matching seam tape to cover the joints. Where 2 panels met to form an outside corner, I used those peel-n-stick clear plastic corner protectors you can get to protect wallpaper, & covered them with the seam tape, to make a smooth, covered edge. Someone else had a posting on a forum recently about where to buy that padded quilted leather for walls, but I can't seem to find the thread.
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tr0y

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 8:17 PM
Post #131445 - In reply to #131382

Hi All -

For insulation we did foam board approx 1.5" thick and glass in the rounded aluminum transitions to the roof.

For wall board and headliner (celling), we took 1/4 Plywood any thinner moves around to much and feels cheap, screwed it to the framing, with gold screws and countersunk the heads filled the screw holes and then attached faux leather and faux stingray fabric to give it the look of leather walls.

Good Luck with your trailer !
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the wrist

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 9:26 PM
Post #131448 - In reply to #131442

Thanks very helpful.  I'll look into the YBC and see if there is a web site.
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the wrist

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 9:28 PM
Post #131449 - In reply to #131445

That sounds very interesting. Thanks for the idea.
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gard

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 10:24 PM
Post #131453 - In reply to #131382

Here's how we completed a weekender:

http://www.horsetrailerworld.com/forum/thread-view.asp?threadid=11440&posts=13

http://www.horsetrailerworld.com/forum/thread-view.asp?threadid=11527&posts=12

http://www.horsetrailerworld.com/forum/thread-view.asp?threadid=11610&posts=1

http://www.horsetrailerworld.com/forum/thread-view.asp?threadid=11674&posts=8

http://www.horsetrailerworld.com/forum/thread-view.asp?threadid=11855&posts=4


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the wrist

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-09 10:58 PM
Post #131458 - In reply to #131453

Wow, Thank you for the past article on the Exiss weekender.  It sounds like I have to think more about a moisture barrior.  Very helpful.  I printed them all to use a reference.
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the wrist

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-10 8:28 AM
Post #131462 - In reply to #131442

The wallpaper type design sounds like something that I would be interested in. I couldn't find any product like it.  Could you be more specific on where you bought it.  thanks
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tr0y

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-10 8:54 AM
Post #131463 - In reply to #131382

What we purchased was material from a custom auto upholstery shop, we bought it locally but I am sure the internet would have a million places to find the materials, i.e fake leather, that they use in custom cars, and then took spray adhesive, 3m super 80 made for auto headliners and applied it to the interior. We went about 2" past where cabs would cover the cut ends.
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the wrist

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-10 12:39 PM
Post #131470 - In reply to #131463

Thank you so much for giving me other options and getting back to me.
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slowrider

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-10 6:29 PM
Post #131490 - In reply to #131462

The wallpaper stuff was made by DPI, called a decorative panel, it is paneling, about 1/8" thick, 4x8 sheets, lightweight, but rigid enough to . www.decpanels.com The web site says you can get at Lowe's, Home Depot, Menards, Do It Best, Sutherlands. If you can find it on a web site, but not in a store, contact the company to find a distributor, see if they will sell retail to you, or if they deal with a retail store near you.
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memory

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-10 8:48 PM
Post #131493 - In reply to #131382

Just a thought..... If someone would like to make some extra money...... We need a dvd of doing a living quarters with a little more detail. especially more steps in the plumbing and wirring catagories. I ordered the one on the internet and was not satisfied with its content. I love Todd's site but need more wiring details.


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tr0y

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-10 11:45 PM
Post #131504 - In reply to #131382

What are you trying to accomplish and I will give you what advice I can. Wiring a trailer is not hard.
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memory

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-11 4:05 PM
Post #131535 - In reply to #131382

I had my breaker box,outlet and shore cord put in by an electrician. I wanted to put some lights overhead and switch for it. I also wanted to put in an outlet on the other side of my dressing room.
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tr0y

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-11 4:09 PM
Post #131536 - In reply to #131382

Please see my new post DIY Trailer Wiring Diagram
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the wrist

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-11 7:10 PM
Post #131543 - In reply to #131382

Your diagram brought up some other questions.  Does the external AC source connnect directly to the converter or the load center.  Or does the wiring just pass through the converter to the load center.


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tr0y

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Subject : RE: Doing your own living quarter
Posted : 2011-03-12 8:16 AM
Post #131562 - In reply to #131382

The way we are wired, is the shore-power or generator enters the system at the inverter / charger, passes 120V AC to AC load center and charges batteries if they need it. DC always draws from the DC Load center and is not altered. When we disconnect from the AC source the inverter draws from the battery bank to provide 120 AC just as if we were plugged in.

This is of course where the solar kicks in and if necessary starts charging batteries to keep them at float voltage.

I did not show the fused links as they would have been really small and hard to see, but all power input links are fused or have a breaker to handle spikes and surges.




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