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Horses out west

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Arieldouglas
Reg. Aug 2013
Posted 2013-09-30 5:00 PM (#155065)
Subject: Horses out west



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Posts: 136
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Location: Watertown, TN
Can someone let us easterners know what to expect when transporting our horses out west? I've been doing my own research because I don't like bad surprises. That doesn't make up for personal experience and knowledge though. Brand inspections are a foreign language to most people east of the Mississippi.
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aceliberty
Reg. Sep 2011
Posted 2013-09-30 8:55 PM (#155071 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Location: central IL

We've traveled from IL as far west as AZ since 2005. We hauled up to 13-14 hour days although we prefer not to trailer more than 12. We only stop long enough for fuel. I would never suggest unloading the horses. We drop the windows and open up the back door for ventilation and scoop manure. We don't leave the trailer unattended with the windows/screens/bars down and open back door though. As for brand inspections, we actually got stopped by a brand inspector traveling through NM. No big deal. Just be sure to have your Coggins and health papers which are only good for 30 days. You want to be in compliance. I used to fret that the horses didn't drink or eat while traveling. No grain in the morning but I do administer a probiotic to ward off colic and ulcers. Been traveling like this over the years, and knock on wood, the horses have always fared real well.

 

We always stay overnight along the way using http://www.horsetrip.com/  and http://www.horsemotel.com/ and have met a lot of great folks doing so. Happy travels.

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Painted Horse
Reg. May 2005
Posted 2013-09-30 9:19 PM (#155072 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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You will need Brand Inspection, Coggins and current health certificate.  Coggins are good for 6 months or 12 months depending on the state. So to be safe, I would make sure your coggins are dated with in 6 months. 

Health certificates are good for 30 days, But usually only list one destination. So list the farthest point you will travel to.  Some states will require your vet to call ahead and get a permit number.  I know if I cross into Montana, my vet has to call Montana and get a permit #, But I don't need to do this for Wyoming or Idaho.  Colorado periodically impliments this procedure if they hear of an outbreak of certain diseases. My vet seems to be aware of these procedures. I suspect he gets a bulletin that is faxed, emailed to him letting him know what the current status is for travel to surrounding states.

Brand Inspection,  Is basically proof of ownership.  Utah issues a temporary, 1 year and lifetime brand inspection, each for a different price.  It's just a pocket card with a description of the horse signed by the area brand inspector. Newer brand inspection now have a digital photo printed on one side.  I've also used breed registration papers for proof of ownership.
But basically have something in your possession from your home area that details the color and markings of your horse. If your vet does a good job, your Coggins and Health Certificates should describe your horse.  Some states like Wyoming want you to stop and have a brand inspector look at your horse and approve their entering the state. You can check their respective websites for rules for each state you plan to cross.

Any public land,  ( Forest Service, BLM, State Trust lands, National Parks etc) will require you to have certified weed free feed. So the only time you can feed non-certified feed is when you are on private land.

Port of Entries as you enter each state will want to stop and come inside, They usually want to you to fill out a form that details where you are coming from and where you going and to list your coggins and health certificate numbers.

As far as travel.  I usually stick to less than 11 hours in the trailer. I try to find fair grounds, public land or private camps to stop and get the horse out for the night and let them stretch their legs. During hot weather, I often stop at Fairgrounds and put the horse in their wash rack and get them good and wet to help them stay cool.

 

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Arieldouglas
Reg. Aug 2013
Posted 2013-10-01 5:39 AM (#155076 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Posts: 136
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Location: Watertown, TN
The brand inspection aspect is the main thing that seems to be different. What do the states accept as proof of ownership. If coggins and health certificate is good enough great but some websites make it sound like it's not enough.Personally I prefer not to haul more than 10 hours before I let the girls out to stretch their legs.What should people expect to pay for weed free hay and how available is it? If you look at the maps, it looks like most of the land out west belongs to the Fed. So is the weed free requirements only on USDA/Forest Service land or on BLM land as well?
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Arieldouglas
Reg. Aug 2013
Posted 2013-10-01 5:43 AM (#155078 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Location: Watertown, TN
Oops! I see it is all Fed land.And why does the forum delete my paragraph?
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Painted Horse
Reg. May 2005
Posted 2013-10-01 6:21 AM (#155079 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Location: Northern Utah

A lot of the states back east don't have Brand Inspectors.  So you can't get a brand inspection done in your home state. I know here in Utah, I need to document the purchase or birth of a horse to get my brand inspection. Hence the registration papers are my main source of ownership.  It shows that the horse was born on my property or that I bought and transferred ownership.  Bring something that is more than a handwritten bill of sale.

It's too easy to steal a horse and write a bill of sale note. Something that is dated, with a description of the horse ( photo is even better) will be better than nothing to help establish your ownership.  Then you can stop as you enter a western state and buy a brand inspection

Certified hay in Utah is $1 to $2 more per bale than non-certified hay and is available at most farm stores. Farm stores are more expensive than buying from farmers, But it is just too hard to find which farmers actually grow the hay. I pay $8.00 to $9.00 for certified alfalfa.  It is really hard to find certified grass. Anything certified is almost always going to be Alfalfa here in Utah.

Most processed feed. Such as hay pellets will meet the certified rules.  Since the heating and grinding involved in making pellets destroys the seeds. So if you can't find bales of certified hay, you can easily buy pellets at any feed store.

Hay Cubes are not always certified, since they don't grind the hay as fine, It is usually just chopped and then cubed. So it will usually say Certified on the bag meaning it came from certified hay before cubing.

The rules apply to ALL public lands, Forest Service, BLM, and State Trust lands. These make up 74% of Utah. So certified feed is needed at almost any trail ride in Utah.

Bring pellets from home and buy certified hay here in the west as you travel. I've seen folks bring certified hay they bought in the mid west and it looks pretty nasty in comparison to our wonderful hay.  Growers back east don't understand the rules and you get in trouble.  Each bale should have a certification tag or strings. Since the law enforcement officer in Utah may have no idea what color string in Nebraska is used for certification, It can be hard to explain.  And a single letter for 20 bales just doesn't cut it. Each bale needs to be marked by something that is recognizable to  an officer here in the west.

 

 

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Arieldouglas
Reg. Aug 2013
Posted 2013-10-01 10:21 AM (#155084 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Posts: 136
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Location: Watertown, TN
Thanks PH.This is the kind of info anybody thinking about going west needs.
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ottomcnab
Reg. Feb 2011
Posted 2013-10-01 2:41 PM (#155088 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west


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Posts: 15

Location: S.E. Louisiana
Traveled all over the west also and stopped, checked many times. No brand inspection ever required, just coggins and health certificate. Of course we are from a state that does not require them but does require chipping--no you do not need to chip your horse if you are passing through this state either. Weed free is VERY hard to find, I would try and stay clear of state and federal campgrounds because of this. I know some just keep the colored string handy and re-wrap their regular hay. Many campground host don't check anyway if you want to take that chance.
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longearsruletwo
Reg. Feb 2011
Posted 2013-10-01 4:21 PM (#155091 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west


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Location: Grapeland, Texas
We went to South Dakota last month and was told you didn't need a brand inspection to get in the state, but needed one to get out.  Makes no sense to me but we went ahead and got a lifetime brand inspection on our mules because we hope to go back to some western states to ride in the future.  We came back thru Wyoming, Colorado and New Mexico and were never asked to see them, or any papers.  No inspection stations were open when we came thru, that we could tell anyway.  But I'd rather be safe than sorry.  We had several years of coggins on the mules and he took that as proof of ownership.  I knew I was saving all of them for some reason, lol.
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longearsruletwo
Reg. Feb 2011
Posted 2013-10-01 4:29 PM (#155092 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west


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Forgot to comment on the weed free hay.  We fed the certified weed free pellets, timothy.  The mules did very well on it and it sure is a lot neater than hay.  We haul any hay in the front stall of the trailer so it was nice to have it clean.  I have heard horror stories on "weed free" hay and was almost scared to try and buy any.  We did buy 2 bales of hay in South Dakota, paid $12 and it was really nice hay.  I was worried on how they would do on the pellets but they did great. 
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Arieldouglas
Reg. Aug 2013
Posted 2013-10-01 4:58 PM (#155093 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Posts: 136
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Location: Watertown, TN
That's me. I'm firmly in the better safe than sorry camp. Going into Kentucky once with a group of four other trailers, including my brother who informed me he didn't need or have time to get health certificates, we all got stopped. I was the only one with current health certificates. The inspectors were going to let them go with written warnings till one of the guys got a little too mouthy. They all wound up with $250.00 fines and a "If you don't shut up you'll be paying a quarantine bill."I think I will buy the lifetime inspection as well since it is good in all states that require a brand inspection and Canada.I always wonder about the pellets. I've heard people say they can cause horses to be colicky. Never actually met anyone that said "The hay pellets caused my horse to colic." though. My horses are on pasture when not traveling so they are used to grazing and hay at camp. I guess if we went that route, some home trials will be in order.
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yeehaw
Reg. Mar 2010
Posted 2013-10-01 5:24 PM (#155094 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west


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Location: Richmond, Ky
Arieldouglas, could you please explain some on the lifetime papers, having to have Ky and Tn papers kinda gets expensive.
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Arieldouglas
Reg. Aug 2013
Posted 2013-10-01 6:26 PM (#155096 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Posts: 136
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Location: Watertown, TN
Sorry. I thought I had the paragraph thing figured out.

The lifetime paperwork I was talking about is the lifetime brand inspection from out west. Seems most of them offer it and reciprocate with the other states and Canada.

If you are asking about health certificates, as far as I know 30 days is it and I think that's the way it should be. I can name several times in the past few years where infected horses were brought to camps. The result was the needless destruction of horses belonging to people that took care of their animals and followed the rules.
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Arieldouglas
Reg. Aug 2013
Posted 2013-10-01 6:32 PM (#155097 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Posts: 136
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Location: Watertown, TN
I do understand the expense though.It used to be that if you were from TN or KY, you could ride all of LBL or BSF without a health certificate because the parks were in both states. Then KY changed their stance and TN followed suit. Now we have to have papers when we go to the KY side of the parks.
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Arieldouglas
Reg. Aug 2013
Posted 2013-10-01 6:37 PM (#155098 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Posts: 136
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Location: Watertown, TN
I don't get it!!!!How come sometime I have paragraphs and sometimes I don't?Pleas help!
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Painted Horse
Reg. May 2005
Posted 2013-10-02 10:20 AM (#155114 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Location: Northern Utah

It just depends on who is looking, what they want to see.  National Parks, Rider organizers etc want to see the Coggins to make sure you are bringing healthy animals.  Port of Entry want to see the health certificate for travel. County Sheriffs and others involved stock theft want to see brand inspection and health certificates. 

So most trips it's just the health papers that ever get looked at. Most park rangers could care less about who owns a horse. There concern is transmission of contagious diseases and the spread of weeds. 

The bottom line is, If you need it and don't have it.  Then you could be sitting on the side of the highway in the hot sun while the officer figures out what to do with you.

 

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Painted Horse
Reg. May 2005
Posted 2013-10-02 12:02 PM (#155118 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west



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Posts: 2453
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Location: Northern Utah

Arieldouglas  Try a different browser.

There are several website that I have problems with when I use Internet Explorer,  For those sites, I switched to Google Chrome and the problems went away.  Some of the web designers that I know say they are just having fits trying to stay compatible with all the web browser that are now available.

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bbsmfg3
Reg. Dec 2006
Posted 2013-10-03 10:44 AM (#155137 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west


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Posts: 376
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Location: Missouri
Most items have been covered. Brand inspections are probably the most difficult to comply with. They have to be done by a Brand Inspector. Sometimes finding a Brand Inspector is a real trick, especially while your traveling. Good idea to line up several Inspectors before you start your trip.

As to prove of ownership. If you don't have registration papers, a photo with your vet writing on the back of the photo, stating this horse belongs to you is a good document.

I've seen years when none of the paper work was ever check, and other years when they have been checked many, many times. One year while traveling thru CO, we were checked 14 times. You could hardly read the papers for all of the stamps they had put on them.

Very good idea, to have very adequate proof of ownership. IF you should get checked for Brand Inspections and don't have them, your in a world of trouble without well documented proof of ownership. The few times we were checked for Brand Inspections and didn't have them on all horses, they accepted our documentation and sent us on our way.
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longearsruletwo
Reg. Feb 2011
Posted 2013-10-04 12:39 PM (#155151 - in reply to #155093)
Subject: RE: Horses out west


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Location: Grapeland, Texas
Arieldouglas, I suppose any change of feed could cause colic but the only thing I have heard about pellets is some horses can choke on them. You can add water to them and that will help with the choking problem.  We tried the water but they did better with feeding them dry, just made sure they had plenty of water available.
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bbsmfg3
Reg. Dec 2006
Posted 2013-10-04 2:35 PM (#155158 - in reply to #155093)
Subject: RE: Horses out west


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Posts: 376
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Location: Missouri
".I always wonder about the pellets. I've heard people say they can cause horses to be colicky. Never actually met anyone that said "The hay pellets caused my horse to colic." though. My horses are on pasture when not traveling so they are used to grazing and hay at camp"

Do not forget, you can not feed pellets exclusively for any extended periods. A few days maybe, but even the manufacturers of the pelletized hay will tell you, a horse needs long stem roughage that is only available from grazable plants and/or real hay.

There are pelletized hay and their are cubes. I've never seen a horse choke on the pellets, but have had several choke on the cubes.

Standlee hay company is selling their small bales of hay, almost nation wide. Good idea to check and see if you can get some of it, prior to your trip. I have Tractor Supply order mine in several weeks before we make our trips to the west. That way I can pack it ahead of time and get my horses accustomed to the hay change.
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RidnClyde
Reg. Jun 2012
Posted 2013-10-16 9:19 AM (#155385 - in reply to #155065)
Subject: RE: Horses out west


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Posts: 98
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Location: MD

Electrolyte tube paste morning and evening works great on my horse along with every 3 hour stops for 20 minutes to offer water and for horses to catch a few zzzz's.  As someone mentioned above, I carry the compressed Alfalfa, hay cubes soaked in a gallon of water, beet pulp soaked in water and then carry regular hay.  I get the Alfalfa and hay cubes from Tractor Supply.  All the "soaking" along with Electrolytes keeps them well hydrated.

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