Posted 2008-02-20 8:48 PM (#77461 - in reply to #77297) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Expert
Posts: 3853 Location: Vermont
Originally written by hounddog on 2008-02-19 6:27 PM
No joke.Rust through has not been a issue in a long long time.Manufactures did lots of studys and metal up grades starting with studys on the coasts and islands.Islands were/are the worst for rust.The undercoating/rustproofing industarys hey day is long gone.Mid 80s was the turning point.I saw studies and read about the changes,was able to talk to engineers that all they did was rust study.Go on truck and auto forums.Rust is NEVER a subject or issue.Paint chips/fade etc is sometimes but not rust.Note the vehicles and year models you come across and look at body condition.
I have a 2000 Chevrolet K2500 that is showing rust thru in the floor of the cab at the door opening and no where else...
Posted 2008-02-20 10:22 PM (#77471 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Expert
Posts: 1871 Location: NY
what every one is forgetting is that technology is always improving thing ( lead in paint use in homes, now they have better paint and safer) as the technology get here so it can be used. remember cars long time did not have air bag or seatbelt now all have then and they are work to save live. horse trailer use to be metal box on wheel that was it ,breaks and light were not always needed , Look at what we have now aluminum trailer, who would every think that aluminum would be able to hole a horse . So the making of trailer will go forward you never know what is around the corner
Posted 2008-02-21 8:26 AM (#77492 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Expert
Posts: 5870 Location: western PA
Dupli Color can be applied to an unprimed, properly prepared, bare metal surface as can many other products. When included, acetone is used as a thinner to allow the product to flow out, and quickly evaporates. It has no bonding strength and is not used as an adhesive. Dupli Color uses ketones and toluene as thinners.
Whenever any two surfaces are bonded together, the surfaces have to be properly prepared. This would include steel, aluminum, fiberglass, and paint. Just as you would not attempt a fiberglass repair without a proper surface conditioning, nor should a coat of paint be applied to a contaminated surface.
As stated, make sure the manufacturer's recommendations are closely followed. This will ensure that their products will perform to an optimum quality.
Posted 2008-02-21 8:40 AM (#77494 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Location: Texas
The largest ingredient, as a percentage, in Dupli color, is acetone, used not only to thin the material, but to soften the paint on the surface it is applied to. Check the MSDS sheet on the product. It will not bond for long to unpainted/unprimed metal, regardless how it is prepared, or who applies it. I tried this, on your advice, and against the advice of the people that did it for me, and they were right. To do it right, you must apply a good bonding primer to the bare metal first. It will adhere well to painted surfaces, like a truck bed, that it was designed for. Anybody that is thinking about using this product should check with the manufacturer about it's intended use before they spend the time and money.
Posted 2008-02-21 9:02 AM (#77499 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Expert
Posts: 5870 Location: western PA
I have used Dupli Color successfully for years, as well as several members of our club who I helped to install it. During the year, about once a month I hose out the floor without removing the mats. At the end of the season I pull the mats and pressure wash the whole floor, top and bottom. The material looks like new and has performed flawlessly.
Since you did not personally apply your surface, and I have successfully done several, I can only speculate that the instructions were not followed correctly. This may be the reason for your bitterness, when it apparently has had subsequent issues.
This product can be applied over an unprimed surface. I have done so and it works as advertised. I and several other people I know are very pleased. I can't say any more than that.
To lump all additive coatings into a do not use category, because of your issues, would cause a disservice to those who could benefit from them. I have no ties to this product, other than it provided the means to an outcome I desired.
Posted 2008-02-21 9:29 AM (#77505 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Location: Texas
Bitter I'm not. I'm just a cowboy, not an engineer or scientist, but I can read and dial a phone, and that is all I'm suggesting anyone thinking about using one of these products do before they tackle the job. I think Sundowner is now caught up in this problem because they relied on a product, Suncoat, that did not work as advertised. I am not saying the products don't work, because they do, but only if used as they are intended. I've been blessed with the ability to earn a living doing something I love and not working for anyone, and I am only an expert at making mistakes, because I make them regularly. I'm man enough to admit mine when I make them. Are You?
Posted 2008-02-21 9:43 AM (#77507 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Expert
Posts: 5870 Location: western PA
It's been my experience that the only people that don't make mistakes are those who do nothing and who complain the most.
My life has been an accumulation of mistakes. I worked on commercial aircraft for 34 years and built boats for 19. I've never had the privilege of being a cowboy, I doubt that I'm man enough.
Just what mistake should I now be held responsible?
Posted 2008-02-21 10:27 AM (#77508 - in reply to #77507) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Location: Texas
I'm not trying to start a big deal here, I just stated what I learned the hard way in hopes others will do their homework before they jump in and make the same mistake based just on your opinion. For everyones' information, I had the work done by the same dealer I bought the trailer from, and they gave me a deal on it, same as they give me a discount on the trailers I buy from them. The trailer was an '06 Elite that I hauled 72,000 miles last rodeo season. The dealer discovered the problem when I traded the trailer in for the '08 Elite I'm pulling now. They didn't make a big deal out of it, even though the mistakle was mine since I insisted they do put the material in over their objection. I use the 1" Profoam under 3/4" rubber mats in the trailer, so there was never any direct impact on the material. It is just that when subjected to continous flexing and twisting, it will not stay. I have used Herculiner in hunting Jeeps and use Rhinoliner or LineX on all my truck beds with excellent results, but they were applied over paint. Adios.
Posted 2008-02-21 3:06 PM (#77541 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Expert
Posts: 1283 Location: Home of Wild Turkey Whiskey
I thought anytime you tried to paint/apply a coating to aluminum you had to use the etching type primer. I seem to remember in the military they use it on planes(it's kind of an ugly greenish color), I know I have painted some aluminum in the past and had to use it then. It has some type of acid in it because they package it in glass.
Posted 2008-02-21 4:22 PM (#77550 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Expert
Posts: 5870 Location: western PA
If you use muriatic acid before applying any type of finish to aluminum, it will stop any oxidation, clean the aluminum and it will etch the metal. This ensures a good bond. It's this step, that most people who are complaining about an insufficient adhesion, have neglected to administer.
Aluminum, whether it is drawn, rolled, cast, forged or extruded is usually too smooth for the application of most common paint products to perform well. The correct steps have to be followed. Neglecting any of them will result in an insufficient adhesion.
The "green" stuff is called Finch primer. It is commonly used in the aircraft industry on surfaces that will be coated. It does not stop active oxidation and is only applied to new or refurbished surfaces.
Posted 2008-02-21 4:35 PM (#77552 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Location: Texas
The dealer acid etched my floor, washed it with some kind of soap, then acid washed it again before they applied the Dupli color. I don't care how you prepare the aluminum, if you don't prime it, the stuff won't stick for long. I've done business with this dealer a long time and he has never done an inadequate job of anything. He would have done it right the first time, but I told him I had expert info. from an internet wizard. I've said more on this than anything before, and I'm done. I just hope folks do their homework. I would like to hear from Sundowner if that really is the problem, just so we'll know.
Posted 2008-02-21 5:07 PM (#77554 - in reply to #77552) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Expert
Posts: 5870 Location: western PA
Originally written by Tx. Vaquero on 2008-02-21 5:35 PM
He would have done it right the first time, but I told him I had expert info. from an internet wizard. QUOTE]
So single handily, I am the sole reason for your life's problems? And what about the people who have had no issues? Should they apologize to you for their successes? Sorry life is so difficult.
Posted 2008-02-21 5:40 PM (#77556 - in reply to #77554) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Expert
Posts: 1283 Location: Home of Wild Turkey Whiskey
Originally written by gard on 2008-02-21 5:07 PM
Originally written by Tx. Vaquero on 2008-02-21 5:35 PM
He would have done it right the first time, but I told him I had expert info. from an internet wizard. QUOTE]
So single handily, I am the sole reason for your life's problems? And what about the people who have had no issues? Should they apologize to you for their successes? Sorry life is so difficult.
The Internet Wizard
Dude are you having a bad day? Tx. says his didn't work, you can keep calling him an idiot if you want to, I don't think he has any reason to lie about his own trailer. He has said many times he is just a cowboy, and even in this thread he has admitted to being self taught through mistakes. You and your club members have had good luck,......... he didn't. From past experiences I have been told by people that are much smarter than me that aluminum has to have an etching primer before any coatings will stick. If he had this problem he is just trying to say that maybe this was Sundowners problem also.
Posted 2008-02-22 5:18 PM (#77637 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Expert
Posts: 1283 Location: Home of Wild Turkey Whiskey
Well Tx. ticked him off, then I tried to explain Tx.'s point, and ole Gard let me have it in a private message. I don't understand the whole ripping someone in a private message. I guess thats the difference in folks like him, and folks like me, If I got something to say to you, I'll say it in front of everyone.
Posted 2008-02-22 5:26 PM (#77639 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Location: Texas
Hope it wasn't anything I said. Maybe he just took a breather to re-evaluate his manhood. Sorry, that wasn't a very Christian thing to say. Maybe he'll PM me and I can send him some tickets to come watch me rope in Houston.
Posted 2008-02-22 7:24 PM (#77653 - in reply to #76773) Subject: RE: ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
Location: Texas
Yeah, it'd be a hop, but he might enjoy it. I went up close to Ft. Worth the first of this week and on the way up I bought diesel for $3.29, coming back it was $3.59. Makes no sense to me.
ATTN: OWNERS OF SUNDOWNER TAILERS
