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Talk to me about licensing laws
 MrTruck, txdad, windy Last Activity 2014-11-25 9:52 PM
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willrodeo4food

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Subject : Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2009-12-30 1:48 PM
Post #114667

for towing a trailer. I just found out that in Nevada you must have a J endorsement to tow anything over 10,000 pounds & an R endorsement to tow anything under 10,000 pounds. Both endorsements require both a written & driving test. Apparently this went into effect in mid 2008 and I had no idea. It seems I am not the only one in my area that was unaware of this. so some of my many stupud questions are: Do other states have these requirements? Does this mean that U-haul will require anyone that rents one of their little trailers to have this endorsement on their license? Someone on **cough cough** that other forum **cough cough** says this endorsement requirement is a federal law, but I'm apparently an idiot & am not googling the right word combination to find this law. Can anyone help with that?Thanks guys.

[Edited by willrodeo4food on 2009-12-30 1:50 PM]

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windy




Joined: 2004-10-14
Location: Colorado

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2009-12-30 4:33 PM
Post #114668 - In reply to #114667

It's one of those "It depends" questions. Generally (not in every single instance, but most of the time) you need to have the kind of license required by the state you reside in to drive your vehicle. Most states have reciprocity with other states, and recognize their laws if different from their own. Most, not all. If you are driving a commercial motor vehicle, there are federal rules as well. The best thing is to look up your own state's laws, and then get the apropriate license. I also think it's a good idea to keep a copy of your state's rules in your vehicle. If you are ever questioned about why you have a particular license, having that with you won't hurt. It may not save the day, but it won't hurt.  
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flatlandfilly

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2009-12-30 9:25 PM
Post #114682 - In reply to #114667

What do the J and R Endorsements mean in Nevada?

There has been discussion on this site before about that 10,000 pound cut off. Some have said over 10,000 (now is that trailer and tow vehicle together?)you need a Commercial Driver's License (CDL). What if any endorsements required were not mentioned. I believe that would be federal because it is Department of Transportation (DOT).

Try looking up Department of Transportation regulations. (That's federal government.) Try the same for Nevada. Nevada should publish a driver's manual for CDL holders and laws should be in there.

A few years ago a Nebraska State Trooper appeared at the horse expo to talk about rules and regs. We all thought we'd finally find out what we needed to have in order to haul legally.

Turns out there are at least three different manualw, state, federal and something else. It also depended if you were stopped by state or local law enforcement or carrier enforcement. "It depends" seems to be the best answer we could get.

Also confusing was when was a horse trailer an RV? How much "living quarters" were required to qualify?

Good luck on your search. Keep us posted.
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hosspuller

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2009-12-30 11:06 PM
Post #114688 - In reply to #114667

State laws vary all over the place.

For North Carolina: Effective 9/1/08

SECTION 1. G.S. 20-7(a)(3) reads as rewritten:

"(3) Class C. – A Class C license authorizes the holder to drive any of the following:

a. A Class C motor vehicle that is not a commercial motor vehicle.

b. When operated by a volunteer member of a fire department, a rescue squad, or an emergency medical service (EMS) in the performance of duty, a Class A or Class B fire-fighting, rescue, or EMS motor vehicle or a combination of these vehicles.

c. A combination of noncommercial motor vehicles that have a GVWR of more than 10,000 pounds but less than 26,001 pounds. This sub-subdivision does not apply to a Class C license holder less than 18 years of age."

Section c. changed the limits for horse trailer pullers.  An ordinary car license is now good for a combined weight of 26,000 pounds.  The catch is: one has to be 18 years of age and non-commercial.

 


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Paracadista


Joined: 2009-10-15
Location: centrally located amongst the "NUTS"

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2009-12-31 11:45 AM
Post #114700 - In reply to #114667

This topic covers many different issues. If you are operating a vehicle to engage in commerce, your vehicle must be tagged with commercial plates. Technically this means if you have a chance of being paid for the activity in which you are participating, regardeless if it is at a profit, you are engaging in commercial activity. If you enter a show or competition, regardless if you win money, you are engaged in commerce. The $2.00 pemium your kid gets at the county fair applies. If you haul anything anywhere to be sold, it applies. I know that this sounds crazy, and it is, but it is subject to enforcement. If you do not leave the state in which your vehicle is registered, you are engaged in "intrAstate commerece. If you do leave the state in which your vehicle is registered, you are engaged in intErstate commerce. A different set of rules apply for these classifications. Also, the IRS DOES NOT have the same standard as the DOT for what qualifies as commercial activity so for income tax purposes see a qualified accountant!

If the combination (trk and trl) is 26001 GVWR with a trl less than 10000 GVWR you need a class B CDL. This rarely applies to livestock haulers. If your vehicle comination is 26001 GVWR with a trl more than 10000 GVWR, YOU MUST HAVE A CLASS A CDL. Weight limit laws vary from state to state, but the commercial drivers licence is goverend by Federal law. You must comply with both. The state laws/codes can only be more strict than, not less than, the Federal code. Your vehicle loaded weight cannot exceed your vehicle registration weight maximum. You vehicle also cannot exceed the maximum weight allowed, gross and per axle, of the state you are in when you get checked. Just because you are legal when you are in one state doesnt mean that you can enter any state and still be legal.

I hope that I have not further confused anyone. I have proof read this and hope that I didnt miss anything. I would advise that if anyone has any questions on their particular situation, contact a DOT certified law enforcment official within your state and DO NOT accept an answer that they are not completly certain of, and remember that you are still liable in the instance that they have give you incorrect information. Sorry for being so long winded, but it is complicated.


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loveduffy

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-01 9:57 PM
Post #114748 - In reply to #114667

it goes back to the question  who's on first
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Paracadista


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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-02 2:37 PM
Post #114770 - In reply to #114667

One thing I forgot to mention, if and when you decide to go the CDL route you are required to get a DOT physical (medical) every 2 yrs and are required to carry your physical card with you whenever you are driving a vehicle that requires a CDL.
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greyhorse

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-02 8:33 PM
Post #114771 - In reply to #114770

Originally written by Paracadista on 2010-01-02 2:37 PM

One thing I forgot to mention, if and when you decide to go the CDL route you are required to get a DOT physical (medical) every 2 yrs and are required to carry your physical card with you whenever you are driving a vehicle that requires a CDL.


That's if the vehicle is a commercial vehicle, not all vehicles that require a CDL are commercial. At least that's what they told me when I got my CDL in TX.
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brushycreekranch




Joined: 2006-06-12
Location: Central Arkansas

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-02 9:54 PM
Post #114773 - In reply to #114667

I have been told multiple times by law enforcement, that you do not need a CDL if you are pulling a fully self contained (LQ) trailer and not hauling horses for the public. Every time I have gone thru the scales, they have waved me thru and acted like I was the village  idiot for stopping in!

My trucks do carry adequate weight tags for my trailers. But in AR, that means they have a commercial tag since they consider all weight tags to be commercial here. AR doesn't have RV tags.



[Edited by brushycreekranch on 2010-01-02 9:58 PM]

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Paracadista


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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-03 9:02 AM
Post #114787 - In reply to #114667

Greyhorse, I am not familiar with the requirments in TX. If you choose to haul in Ohio, you are only exempt if you are a farmer hauling your goods from your field to your farm and from your farm to market. The medical requirement is to ensure that you are physically capable of operating the vehicle regardless of its purpose.

I too am greatful that in most states we drive past scales with the thought of not dealing with the hassle, but there are some (Iowa) that will roadside check DRW 1 tons pulling stock/horse trailers.  In my experience (good) they were only interested to see my DL and med card, the vehicle reg., and to make sure I had my safety chains attached.  I was pulling a LQ with a DRW 1 ton for a non-comm pupose but they are tagged commercial so that I am in compliance when I go to sales or shows. 

As for the original post, on an Ohio class D (basic) DL there is not a J endorsment only a J1 and it has nothing to do with the type of vehicle operated and the R endorsment is for a 3 wheeld motorcycle. On the Ohio issued class A there is no   J1 because if you need it you will not pass the physical, bioptic/telescoptic lens required. Also the Ohio class A has a K1 endorsment for an Intrastate only CDL (usually for people between 18-21 since you must be 21 to haul Interstate).

As I stated earlier, the requirements differ from state to state and it is complicated.  I am interested to know the requirements in different states.


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Paracadista


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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-04 7:03 PM
Post #114876 - In reply to #114667

Let me the first, and I hope this is the standard on this forum, to point out that I was incorrect in saying that a med card is required with a CDL while hauling for personal use in Ohio.  I sopke with a DOT inspector today to get some clarification on this topic.  I was not able though to get calrification on wether the type of vehicle registration i.e commercial vs. recreation vehicle changes the requirement. I will try tomorrow (I talk to them frequently) to get all of the information that I can to try to avoid further inncorrect post. 

I appoligize to all who have read these.


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greyhorse

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-06 10:44 PM
Post #114977 - In reply to #114876

I'm not sure you were incorrect (at least where you are) and it sure wouldn't hurt to have a med card, it's not like it's hard for most people to get one.
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akinstrailers

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-07 4:59 PM
Post #114999 - In reply to #114667

When we were pulled over in CA (told NV is the same) the officer informed us that since we had a combined GVWR of over 26001 lbs we were required to have a CDL. He said there is an exemption for RV's but since we had horses we were not able for the exemption. Being from OR we were not aware of the requirements. The officer confessed that he often hears fellow officers over the airwaves talking about the idiot that stopped at the scales (even though they are required too). The only reason he knew the law was he called into headquarters to see what the law was! We ended up paying the $75 fine rather then spend the money to get a CDL that we don't need in our home state. Talking with friends from NV all they had to do is get a non-commercial CDL which consisted of a written test and a drive test for which they used their stock trailer. Hope this helps...
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Paul D

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-07 9:33 PM
Post #115012 - In reply to #114876

Originally written by Paracadista on 2010-01-04 7:03 PM

Let me the first, and I hope this is the standard on this forum, to point out that I was incorrect in saying that a med card is required with a CDL while hauling for personal use in Ohio.  I sopke with a DOT inspector today to get some clarification on this topic.  I was not able though to get calrification on wether the type of vehicle registration i.e commercial vs. recreation vehicle changes the requirement. I will try tomorrow (I talk to them frequently) to get all of the information that I can to try to avoid further inncorrect post. 

I appoligize to all who have read these.

I have had a CDL class A license since they became available in the 80's here in Illinois. I have driven both with and without a current DOT physical card. I have never been questioned about the DOT card when I was not hauling for hire or as you say for commercial purposes. I believe the only time the DOT physical is required is if you are hauling for hire/commercially and that is the only time I maintain a current DOT card.

Paul


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headhunter

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-10 12:38 PM
Post #115091 - In reply to #114667

I am in Washington state, and contacted WA DOL when I bought my LQ trailer I pull with a DRW 1 ton. I contacted them by email, printed out the response, and keep in in my glove box of my truck in case I'm ever pulled over in another state, I can show I am legal in my home state. I'd have to go pull it out to see what it says, but I believe in WA you don't need a CDL for anything privately owned (a LQ trailer is considered an RV), and no CDL is required if you are under 26,001. But again, I'd have to go check for the exact terms, but whatever it was, I was legal as a private hauler with my 3 horse 9' LQ trailer.
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Penejoe

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-11 8:37 AM
Post #115111 - In reply to #114667

This subject has been discussed so many times I thought I would add my two cents worth. This isn't about a horse trailer but a few years back my brother in law was stopped in La for driving past the scales???? he was pulling a 30ft fifth wheel camper. The idiot that stopped him told him he had to have a cdl and stop at the scales. My brother in law knowing better took the ticket and of course after going straight to his attorney when he got home had the ticket thrown out.  I think headhunter has the right idea. Just make sure you are legal in your state!!!! From past experience and having a husband that retd from law enforcement after 25 years the problem is they put these guys out on the roads and highways strap a gun on them and off they go, having no knowledge of the law whatsoever.
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akinstrailers

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Subject : RE: Talk to me about licensing laws
Posted : 2010-01-11 12:56 PM
Post #115124 - In reply to #114667

One important thing to remember is it is not the actual weight you are hauling, but your combined GVWR. If your truck is rated at 12k and your trailer is rated at 14,500 you are over the legal limit in most states.
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