Posted 2011-04-19 1:34 PM (#133182) Subject: generators and AC again please
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 330 Location: northeast Texas
I have made up my mind, with Japan in turmoil, that I am going this afternoon and purchasing a Honda EU3000is genset. What does it mean when they say it runs "some" 13,500 btu AC's? With the little generator we have been using we have found it works best to leave our fan on instead of auto so it doesnt have to start up both compressor and fan motor.
Posted 2011-04-19 3:21 PM (#133195 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 402 Location: Valentine, NE
We had one. 90% of the time it was a non issue. On the hottest days and high humidity, it would shut off when the AC kicked on. Made sure everything else was off, and it would still do it 1 out of 10 times. Installed a 12v fan in the rear tack where it was and it than very, very seldom kicked off. If it did, just let it set a few minutes and it always started right back up and did fine. Sold it to a friend, and he just keeps it in his pickup bed and has had 0 problems.
Posted 2011-04-19 3:51 PM (#133197 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Expert
Posts: 5870 Location: western PA
A standard 13,500 A/C unit uses aprox ~ 14 -15 amps when running. High efficiency units can be as low as 11 amps. However, on start up there is a compressor surge that can almost double these figures. If the generator cannot handle this large of a surge load, it will kick off line.
If you study the generator statistics advertised by Honda, you will notice that their fuel run and noise levels are measured when the generators are at basically an idle situation, and not when they're pulling a load. This gives them very good selling point figures for each of those situations.
Other manufacturers such as Yamaha, rate their units' noise and fuel specifications under a higher load, which is much more applicable to when it is actually being used. The difference is when both brands are being used under a load, they are very similar, much closer than their published specifications would suggest. Honda's advertised specifiations are not apropos for a working unit.
Posted 2011-04-19 4:27 PM (#133199 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 489
I have two EU2000i that I use in parallel to run my AC with no problems. They are much easier to get around than a single 3000 and give you a bit more power.
Posted 2011-04-19 5:08 PM (#133202 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Expert
Posts: 3802 Location: Rocky Mount N.C.
Originally written by CTRider on 2011-04-19 2:34 PM
I have made up my mind, with Japan in turmoil, that I am going this afternoon and purchasing a Honda EU3000is genset. What does it mean when they say it runs "some" 13,500 btu AC's? With the little generator we have been using we have found it works best to leave our fan on instead of auto so it doesnt have to start up both compressor and fan motor.
Quote... What does it mean when they say it runs "some" 13,500 btu AC's?
As an A/C gets older it may take more current to get it started than it did when it was new. These 2800 running watt generators are on the edge of just being able to get a 13.5 A/C up and running. That's why they say "some"....
On a hot day the 3000 Honda may not start the A/C quick enough before kicking the generators overload breaker. I use a Yamaha EF3000iseB, the "B" standing for boost. It has 500 more watts than the EU3000 Honda to help start the A/C. The EU3000Honda has 3000 watts to start and 2800 running watts. The EF3000iseB Yamaha has 3500 watts to start and 2800 watts running. This is the reason I bought the Yamaha over the EU3000 Honda.
Posted 2011-04-19 10:19 PM (#133218 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Expert
Posts: 5870 Location: western PA
This Yamaha 2800 will run either of my A/C units and extra accessories at the same time. It is less expensive than two Honda units, weighs less, uses less fuel, and takes up less space as well. Less is more.
Posted 2011-04-22 1:30 PM (#133345 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 330 Location: northeast Texas
Thanks for the input guys. Retento/Gard, we have a couple Honda dealerships here and they handle Yamaha, but only have the industrial Yamaha in stock. At a ride last weekend I will say a lady had a comparable Subara and that joker was loud. I camp at competitive trail rides once or twice a month and of those that dont have on board gens, most have the Honda 3000. So that is what we went with,. It pretty much stays in the truck so not worried about unloading. Also learned you can parallel 2 of them and husband reasoned it was better to parallel and have 6000 watts than pay more for a couple 2000's than the 3000's price to parallel and only get 4000 watts. So eventually may have 2 of them. Most of the time I dont need the AC anyhow. Seem to end up needing heat more often. I figure it can also run just the fan in the trailer to stir the air. Cranked it at the Honda place and it was more quiet than my 07 Dodge 5.9 Cummins. Next ride May 15th weekend in Texas Hill Country. Will let you know how it works.
Posted 2011-04-26 7:20 PM (#133583 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Regular
Posts: 69 Location: Washington DC
CT I am in the same boat with you. I did a ton of research and pined over it for quite awhile before I bit the bullet and spent the $$. If you haven't already bought one. I have found several that are way below list price on Craigslist. Not sure where you are or what the freight to get it there but I had one of my contacts from my search who owns a rental bussiness that contancted me with a brand new EU3000 for $1500. If your interested, just PM me and I will pass on his email to you. he seemed like a pretty straight forward guy and if you like I could take check it out for you, not that you know me from Adam but, just an offer. I know I have got a lot of help on here and thought I would try and pay it forward.
Posted 2011-04-26 8:06 PM (#133584 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Veteran
Posts: 264 Location: Sumas Washington
There is some difference in 13,500 ac units. I had a Honda 3000 and it started and ran 13500 ac unit fine on any day. I updated to a Carrier 13,500 and the gen would start the AC unit MAYBE 1/2 the time. Didn't make any difference if it was a warm or hot day, first start up or subsequent ones. I talked to a RV manufacturer and he claimed that the Korea made Carrier 13,500 AC units were wired slightly out of phase?? thus the hard start issue. I had tried the Yamaha gen and had the same difficulties. I then switched AC units and had no more problems....
Posted 2011-04-26 9:30 PM (#133590 - in reply to #133583) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Expert
Posts: 3853 Location: Vermont
Originally written by SRWilson on 2011-04-26 7:20 PM
CT I am in the same boat with you. I did a ton of research and pined over it for quite awhile before I bit the bullet and spent the $$. If you haven't already bought one. I have found several that are way below list price on Craigslist. Not sure where you are or what the freight to get it there but I had one of my contacts from my search who owns a rental bussiness that contancted me with a brand new EU3000 for $1500. If your interested, just PM me and I will pass on his email to you. he seemed like a pretty straight forward guy and if you like I could take check it out for you, not that you know me from Adam but, just an offer. I know I have got a lot of help on here and thought I would try and pay it forward.
Posted 2011-04-26 11:31 PM (#133594 - in reply to #133593) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Veteran
Posts: 264 Location: Sumas Washington
Originally written by hosspuller on 2011-04-26 8:52 PM
Originally written by gonzo1066 on 2011-04-26 8:06 PM I talked to a RV manufacturer and he claimed that the Korea made Carrier 13,500 AC units were wired slightly out of phase?? thus the hard start issue.
Doesn't sound kosher to me ... How does a motor get wired slightly out of phase?? Did he mean the motors were wired for 50 hertz?
It has been several years ago the fellow that told me this owned S&S campers in Montana. He has some explanation that made sense to me at the time. However I cannot remember the exact terms he used. All I know is that when I switched brands of air conditioner all of the problems went away..
Posted 2011-04-27 8:20 AM (#133601 - in reply to #133594) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Expert
Posts: 2953 Location: North Carolina
Originally written by gonzo1066 on 2011-04-26 8:31 PM
Originally written by hosspuller on 2011-04-26 8:52 PM
Originally written by gonzo1066 on 2011-04-26 8:06 PM I talked to a RV manufacturer and he claimed that the Korea made Carrier 13,500 AC units were wired slightly out of phase?? thus the hard start issue.
Doesn't sound kosher to me ... How does a motor get wired slightly out of phase?? Did he mean the motors were wired for 50 hertz?
It has been several years ago the fellow that told me this owned S&S campers in Montana. He has some explanation that made sense to me at the time. However I cannot remember the exact terms he used. All I know is that when I switched brands of air conditioner all of the problems went away..
If you were currently having a hard start problem, I would recommend, you look into a "hard start" kit. It is a start capacitor that increases the motor start torque. How this would affect a genset I don't know. But for a few dollars, I would try it.
Posted 2011-05-05 11:42 AM (#133854 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC and no Honda
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 330 Location: northeast Texas
Well the Honda EU3000is will not start up the compressor on our 13,500 ac in the trailer. Ours is a Carrier V Heat pump ducted model with remote control, if that matters. Since we havent actually used the generator, we called Honda and we are taking it back today. They just got in a Yamaha 4500 super quiet inverter model so we are going to switch out (more money hehe) for it. 4500 start up and 4000 running should do the trick. Decibels arent much higher, but we have to have something that works. We wanted the clean inverter power for all the sensitive digital stuff. This is of course a heavier gen but it will pretty much just stay in the truck. We thought about the paralleled Honda 2000 models but were thinking about all night running and refueling and if one stops what will that do to the ac, etc. and decided a little more power in one unit is better.
Posted 2011-09-19 2:34 AM (#137649 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Member
Posts: 5
I am also looking for a new generator because the old one broke down. In order to bypass the time without a generator I will use a generator rental because this is the best option for now. In the mean time I can look for a new generator and can wait until I find a cheap offer. Hopefully I will find one soon.
Posted 2011-09-19 6:29 AM (#137652 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Veteran
Posts: 165 Location: Western Ar
I am very happy with my Kipor 3000, three years ago I gave around $1100 for it. The sound level is similier to Honda. I know a couple of People that are using the Powerhouse Gen and they are very happy with those and the noise level is similier to the Kipor and their specs are quite impressive similier to Yamaha. If money wasn't a factor it would definantly be a yamaha though.
Posted 2011-09-19 1:41 PM (#137670 - in reply to #133182) Subject: RE: generators and AC again please
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 330 Location: northeast Texas
Since my subject has been revisited I thought I would add the Yamaha 4500 has worked beautifully. I have an auxillary fuel tank so it wouldnt fit in the truck. We use a couple mitered boards as a ramp and roll it in and out of the trailer. It stays in the front slant as we only haul 2 horses and use that for storage. It will run my AC and microwave at the same time. Havent overloaded it yet and it is very fuel effecient. We have run it over 12 hours pulling the AC and it wasnt out of gas. You can stand beside it and talk in a normal voice. It was around $3000 I think but a worthy investment as it is something we use alot and it should last us since we take care of it. We have really been impressed with the quality of the Yamaha product.
generators and AC again please
